I do think that if all of these ODMs are indeed saved/regenerate, then I don’t think it would be too far off base to say that all of them, or at least most of them, are entrenched in a seriously carnal/sinful mindset that has deep psychological origins, which have caused them to express their so-called “ministry” via hate, anger, fear-mongering, bitterness, and false accusations — all under the guise of godliness, righteousness, discernment, and righteous indignation against their targets of choice. (Online source)
Now I’m well aware that there are those who don’t want to read things like this. However, I hope we understand this is an important issue that also directly concerns Apprising Ministries because Abanes considers me a part of these alleged “ODMs”; an apparently arbitrary group of unspecified people which he has now labeled a “cult” and who are also supposedly ”entrenched in a seriously carnal/sinful mindset that has deep psychological origins”.
In the real world, those are some very serious charges to level at other professing Christians. For example, here we have this respected evangelical apologist Richard Abanes making the following judgment about Ingrid Schlueter, host of the Crosstalk radio program of VCY America and author of Slice of Laodicea, whom he says is:
someone who, in my personal opinion (as a professional apologist for over 15 years), is one of the worst of the worst ODMs. This ODM has posted her attacks repeatedly against God’s people and encourages others to do likewise (very much like Jezebel encouraged false charges to be brought against God’s people, see 1 Kings 21:10). (Online source)
Today during a discussion between Richard Abanes and myself, where I attempted to point out he appeared to be mocking me at another website, he said:
I called your statement interesting, which I don’t think is mocking.
- Then, I accurately explained/quoted you — not mocking. Then I said “sigh” because you make me sad.
- I followed up with “Joining with unbelievers to help alleviate suffering, of course, is one of the marks of of apostate evangelicalism and its heretical movers and shakers,” which I believe is accurate, no?
- Then, I asked a VERY SERIOUS question, nothing mocking about it: “Another condition on salvation? — Don’t work with unbelievers?”
I concluded with the “gasp” sentence to try to lighten things up again because to be honest, it seems that the very thought of working side by side with a non-Christian is something horrifying to people like you and others. (Online source)
What jumped out at me was this phrase: “to people like you and others.” And I began to wonder: Was I actually witnessing this respected evangelical apologist, and longtime member of Saddleback Church, expressing his own ”so-called ‘ministry’ via hate, anger, fear-mongering, bitterness, and false accusations — all under the guise of godliness, righteousness, discernment, and righteous indignation against their targets of choice”?
So I thought it quite necessary to ask Richard Abanes just who it is he seemingly holds in such disdain:
RA: “to be honest, it seems that the very thought of working side by side with a non-Christian is something horrifying to people like you and others.”
KS: Interesting choice of words. And just who might people like us be Richard; unregenerate? Cultists? Is that who we are? You do have some explaining to do concerning your comments re: ODMs, which ones may be non-Christians? Hey, maybe they are the new lepers, no?
It sort of looks to me like it is you setting yourself apart from people like me and those eery “others.” So do tell Richard…gasp…just who are these mysterious others. I sure know it isn’t me because I’ve worked with tons of non-Christians for years here in my very depressed economically community.
In fact, I was head [football] coach of the local high school and also worked for the school system. I also worked for a couple of years for a gay supervisor in a group home taking care of a couple of mentally incapacitated men where I even changed their adult diapers Richard. Can’t get a lot closer to touching folks than that, huh.
All the while I was also renting a home from a couple of gay men who knew I was a Christian pastor. I got along great with them, and as we discussed the issue in their home, they fully understood why I believe as I do concerning their practice of homosexuality.
And while I was a professional muscian in L.A. for a couple of years, from time to time I’d play my songs out on the street and around Court Houses, which would lead to paying gigs in small clubs. Hung out with many unbelievers and homeless folk every day, who really liked when I’d let them gather ’round me while I played my guitar and sang for them.
So you tell me there Richard, just who are these people like me whom you’re passing judgment upon. I’d really be fascinated to know. (Online source)